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RE: "armoured" spinosaurs



 

 

-----Original Message-----
From: owner-dinosaur@usc.edu [mailto:owner-dinosaur@usc.edu]On Behalf Of StephanPickering@cs.com
Sent: Saturday, January 05, 2002 3:25 AM
To: dinosaur@usc.edu
Subject: "armoured" spinosaurs

 

     If one carefully reads Ernst Stromer's original German papers, it is clear there is more than one individual being described (as the specimens are lost, speculations re: another genus are akin to giving taxonomic status to individual snowflakes), and the elongate neural spines have no centra.<<

 

Wrong, they do have centra, they just aren’t attached. I have seen, taken photo’s of new Spinosaurus vertebrae at a rock show.

 

>> Thus, to say the original type consisted of dorsal spines cannot be proven. In fact, both Spinosaurus and Spinosaurus B, as Mr Stromer presented them, appear to be a disrticulated hodge-podge of elements. To state, as Jack Horner has done, that Spinosaurus probably had an eight foot long skull is based upon no known evidence, as is his idea the animal was 19 feet 7 inches high (including the "fin") and 43 feet 9 inches long. I am trying to be diplomatic: the 1915-2001 idea of Spinosaurus being an enormous theropod, with a Dimetrodon-like sail on its back, cannot be substantiated with any articulated skull and skeleton,<<

 

According to Stromer’s paper (translated) they all belong to one individual. He’s a bit apprehensive about the sacrals, though.

 

 

>> and the cinematic conjuration (like the red "ceratosaur" fleetingly glimpsed with its nonsensical unicorn faciality, or the pteranodons with teeth) was, and remains, a Horrorwood fabrication, a means for Jack Horner to reinforce the concept tyrannosaurs were weak, sluggish "scavengers" (ironic, because spotted hyaenids kill nearly 75% of what they eat, and it is lions who do much prey stealing) on the basis of no scientific evidence.<<

 

You don’t really know his input for the movie and what the producers did, which are two different things.

 

Ø      Young, rapid tyrannosaurs likely chased down and cornered large hadrosaurs for the slower, larger adults to kill with a bite power that is, let us say, of surprising magnitude. And so, we have a cinematic "spinosaur" which never existed, with a thinly constructed neck, surviving the bites of an enraged tyrannosaur (logically, the spinosaur's neck should have been quickly broken, or been decapitated), then breaking the tyrannosaur's neck and tossing it down l! ! ike a doll.<<

Ø        

Ø       It’s just cinema, not a documentary, and if you watch it again you’ll notice the Tyrannosaur has the tip of neck in it’s mouth, not the hole neck.

Ø        

Ø      >> Coupled with this is the unfortunate use of "Spinosauridae" in various cladistic analyses, a nomenclatural chimera, as Spinosaurus remains a nomen dubium (along with Therizinosaurus).  Of interest are the relationships between Baryonyx and Suchomimus:  taxa having long forearms, narrow snouts equipped with non-serrated spike-like dentition. Perhaps like Iguanodon, they were probably functionally quadruped, and the long spines on the back could have been the bases for reinforced musculature to provide a balance for the heavy front part of the body including the head. Like a pair of pinchers, the jaws held prey, the long manal claws killing or disabling. Rather than a "fin", these animals may have looked more like hump-backed bison.  (I am here, I hasten to add, borrowing freely from Jack Bailey's fine 1997 paper on these taxa, and thank Jack for his penetrating  insights.)

 

I must say that I two am disappointed in how the movie has depicted the dinosaurs and have said so on the list, but I’ve come to realize ITS JUST A MOVIE, and People, People, we have to get over this, IT IS JUST A MOVIE!!!! Jesus *()(**&*))9, Get over IT! Don’t see anymore JP movies, don’t buy the video’s, I DON”T KARE!

It is squabbles like this that helps keep the professionals off the list (along with other things). They are made to entertain not educate, that’s why there movies. Documentaries, now that’s another thing entirely….

 

 

Tracy L. Ford

P. O. Box 1171

Poway Ca  92074