RE: Submitting new artwork to the wrath of the DML

["Tracy L. Ford" <dino.hunter@cox.net>]

-----Original Message-----
From: owner-dinosaur@usc.edu [mailto:owner-dinosaur@usc.edu]On Behalf Of
Dann Pigdon
Sent: Sunday, April 14, 2002 2:31 PM
To: dinosaur@usc.edu
Subject: Re: Submitting new artwork to the wrath of the DML

"Tracy L. Ford" wrote:

> "Dann Pigdon" wrote:


>>I'm not saying they didn't fight ever. Hippos will fight to the death,
but for the most part a simple open-mouthed bluff will suffice to deter
rivals. Any animal capable of killing will usually opt for a non-lethal
method of intraspecific combat to begin with. If no-one backs down, then
it can get ugly. I doubt tyrannosaurs solved all of their minor
squabbles by running head-long at each other open-mouthed (as many art
work seems to suggest they did).<<

Ok, but the fossil evidence shows that they did bite each other and almost
every Tyrannosaurus (at least) shows re-healed bite marks on the face, jaws,
top of the head, etc. I'm not sure about the other tyrannosaurids. I know
some do show bite marks on the face. Also, they have lots of broken and
re-healed bones, ribs, limbs, etc.


>>Tyrannosaur non-lethal head butting would explain the rugosities along
the snout, the orbital horns, and the proposed jugal hornlets. Plus they
had the robust skull and neck to pull it off.<<

They could also be individual variation and sexual dimorphism and not used
in combat.

>>Allosaurs seem to have none of these things. Their cranial ornaments
seem to be more fragile, and their skull and long neck don't seem to be
all that robust.>>

Not to mention a very kinetic skull (i.e. loose fitting skull bones as
opposed to tyrannosaurids which are more solidly constructed).

>>Perhaps they used visual bluff most of the time,
opening their mouths as wide as possible, flaring their jaws outwards
where the skull and jaw seams allowed, to fully display their array of
slashing teeth, with their high (and perhaps brightly coloured)
pre-orbital horns and paired nasal ridges (that is, higher than in
tyrannosaurs) adding to the effect. Tyrannosaurs, expecially T.rex, seem
better equipped to handle the stressed of non-lethal head butting than
Allosaurs.<<

One thing in favor of your thinking of T. rex is its head was held in at 45
degree angle to the neck which WOULD allow it to head butt/push better.
Perhaps some of both was used in interspecific battling?

>>Of course, everything I just said about dinosaurs is pure speculation,
so it's certainly nothing to get worked up about (not that HP Ford did -
THIS TIME - but based on past experience, I know how passionate he can
get about his beloved archosaurs).  :)<<

AHHH!!!! Noooo...nooo...I don't want to come across as someone who has a
quick temper. I apologize right here and now to the list if that is the way
I've come across in the past (ok, I did come across that way, but I had my
reasons; I had a flat tire, the cab was late, I lost the directions, it
wasn't my FAULT!!!).


Tracy L. Ford
P. O. Box 1171
Poway Ca  92074