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RE: Triceratops and tropical fish - a question of intellect (theirs, not mine)



From: owner-dinosaur@usc.edu [mailto:owner-dinosaur@usc.edu]On Behalf Of Martin Barnett
 

 My question is this:   If an animal like a fish that has by reputation a memory span of three seconds (don't know fishes well, don't know how true this is) can get it together enough to form a huddle of adults around the young, why not a triceratops herd as portrayed by Mark Hallet in one of his 1984 paintings (not sure if he proposed this idea too) and strongly doubted as a concept of behaviour by many members of the palaeontological community ever since?  Don't get me wrong, I don't believe for one minute that the big fishes did this to defend the littluns, only that the little fish thought they had a better chance of surviving in between the biguns and perhaps the behaviour of Triceratops was carried out on the same motives.  This would make the Mark Hallet version of events a little too regimental, but still…
 Could this be a possibility or were there other grounds on which this claim was dismissed by the many experts who believed it wasn't possible?  Did they already think up and discount or explain away this idea in any papers?
 
 
The idea has NOT been dismissed.  Rather, it has been pointed out that, as yet, we have no *POSITIVE EVIDENCE* for such a behavior.
 
Sure, they could have done it.  No problem.  That's not the point.
 
The point is whether we have any direct evidence to say that it was so.  Trikes could well have hooted and holler at each other to keep track of the herd at long distance; their hoots could have gone "hooot hooot hooot HOOT!"; but we cannot establish that this was in fact the case.
 
Furthermore, the Hallet version is very specific, and modelled directly after the modern musk ox.  Few large horned animals have this particular behavior, and yet because the Hallet picture was so good it became accepted as The Truth.
 
There IS  some evidence that Trikes lived in groups (new discoveries from the Denver region); and it makes sense that they could have employed their powerful heads in a group ring defense.  However, testing whether that particular behavior was used is currently (and perhaps eternally) beyond the ability of science, as is (sadly) a lot of questions about Mesozoic dinosaur behavior.

                 Thomas R. Holtz, Jr.
                Vertebrate Paleontologist
Department of Geology           Director, Earth, Life & Time Program
University of Maryland          College Park Scholars
                College Park, MD  20742      
http://www.geol.umd.edu/~tholtz/tholtz.htm
http://www.geol.umd.edu/~jmerck/eltsite
Phone:  301-405-4084    Email:  tholtz@geol.umd.edu
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