ANKYLOSAURS THE MOVIE

["D.W.Naish" <dwn194@soton.ac.uk>]

THE POLACANTHID CONTROVERSY

I am delighted that this has produced such intelligent discussion. Well done
fellow dinophiles...

Before I speil on about anything else, I have to clear up the mistakes I make..
1) Resurrection of the Polacanthidae is nothing to do with Ken Carpenter, but
the work of Jim Kirkland (of course)
2) Sauropelta is obviously little to do with the polacanthids, and the proposed
third member I was thinking of was Hoplitosaurus marshi. But as Tom said, this
has recently become Polacanthus marshi, and is therefore OBVIOUSLY polacanthid.
I don't think that there are any other 'Hoplitosaurus' species. Are there (if
so, they might be potential polacanthids). Jim Kirkland is also (apparently)
working on two new polacanthids from the U.S.
[Are 'hoplites' something to do with ancient Greek armies? George...?]
3) Minmi paravertebra is restored in Dave Lambert's 'The Ultimate Dinosaur 
Book' AND it's been given lateral caudal spikes... I said that these were 
unique to polacanthids. Three options;
i) Minmi is polacanthid (unlikely me thinks)
ii) The restoration is innaccurate (I haven't seen any good specimens of the
type or the paper describing it)
iii) Big, lateral, caudal spikes are not unique to polacanthids

I am unaware of the study proving that Hylaeosaurus and Polacanthus are 
distinct. I thought that the consensus was that both were known from different
parts of the skeletons, and thus couldn't be adequately compared. As I said, I
have heard suspicions that the shoulder spines were orientated differently in
the two though...

If they were the same (and we seem to be agreeing that they're not) then
Hylaeosaurus would have priority as it was named by Mantell in 1833. 
Polacanthus was named by Huxley in 1867. Probable synonyms of Polacanthus are
Polacanthoides (Nopsca 1928) and Vectensia (Delair 1982). Hylosaurus (Fitzinger
1843) is a synonym of Hylaeosaurus. EVEN IF H. and P. are congeneric, I think 
that Polacanthidae would have family name priority as it was originally 
proposed, regardless of generic priority within the family. On an interesting
diversion, the family Tyrannosauridae should really be called Deinodontidae for
the same reason, and likewise Dinosauria should be called Pachypoda. But there's
some rule stating that when a name becomes so forgotten and superseded by a more
popular term, it can be forgotten. Who knows what the rule is?

AND FINALLY

Kirkland's Mymoorapelta was found with a fossil egg. If it belongs to
Mymoorapelta, then it's the first known definite anky egg. They interpreted it
as aborted during decomposition (same as for the baby ichthyosaurs from
Holzmaden). This brings to me to something I've been itching to talk about for
ages (it's all timing..).... HAS ANYONE HEARD ABOUT THE DINOSAUR EMBRYO FOUND
WITHIN ITS PARENT...

I have to go now, as this room's booked, so no qoute this time..